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Is there any reason why I should bring myself to watch The Web
trevor travis
dragonq wrote:

I am thinking about the guy in the fish tank, aka the alien catheter cock monster (sums it up beautifully, I feel). In fact, he's one of the chief things stopping me watching it again. And I don't buy the thing about even bad Blake's 7 being worth it. I have not watched Animals since it was first screened, and its memory is still green. In other words 30+ years later I still remember it as one of the worst things I have ever seen on TV and I don't need to repeat the experience.

I did rewatch Power recently after many years, and thought it was actually better than I recalled--despite the seriously dodgy gender politics, it was a reasonably well constructed story. I have, however, seen the Web numerous times, and there are no surprises. I am on Avon's side in this one.


But no-one watches B7 for the "special" effects - they watch it for the fantastic characters.
 
trevor travis
Travisina wrote:

trevor travis wrote:

Travisina wrote:

Also, S-L-D still features Cally-the-warrior, rather than Cally-the-vulnerable-to-being-taken-over-by-psychic-forces.


Doesn't SLD contain Cally-the-getting-captured-then-tortured-then-having-to-be-rescued-by-Blake? Wink

Yeah, she gets captured - but only after she's done a fair amount of fighty stuff. Plus she's brave under threat of torture (unlike Vila - 'the word, the word, THE WORD!) and nicely menacing to Travis afterwards. Getting captured was unfortunate, but it wasn't because she was being a girly wimp under psychic influence (eg Ultraworld)


Good points.

Yeah, it does happen a little too easily in "Ultraworld". Especially when, immediately beforehand in "Sacrophagus", it's partly Cally fighting off the alien that allows Avon to defeat it.
 
Travisina
trevor travis wrote:

Travisina wrote:

Also, S-L-D still features Cally-the-warrior, rather than Cally-the-vulnerable-to-being-taken-over-by-psychic-forces.


Doesn't SLD contain Cally-the-getting-captured-then-tortured-then-having-to-be-rescued-by-Blake? Wink

Yeah, she gets captured - but only after she's done a fair amount of fighty stuff. Plus she's brave under threat of torture (unlike Vila - 'the word, the word, THE WORD!) and nicely menacing to Travis afterwards. Getting captured was unfortunate, but it wasn't because she was being a girly wimp under psychic influence (eg Ultraworld)
Twitter: @TravisinaB7
Tumblr: tumblr
There's no point being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes
 
Travisina
dragonq wrote:

I am thinking about the guy in the fish tank, aka the alien catheter cock monster (sums it up beautifully, I feel). In fact, he's one of the chief things stopping me watching it again. And I don't buy the thing about even bad Blake's 7 being worth it. I have not watched Animals since it was first screened, and its memory is still green. In other words 30+ years later I still remember it as one of the worst things I have ever seen on TV and I don't need to repeat the experience.

You're not wrong about 'Animals' - not only is it stupid, it manages to be boring too.
The guy in the fish tank in the Web is disturbingly bad, but the tank guy in Moloch is even worse (as is Moloch himself).

I did rewatch Power recently after many years, and thought it was actually better than I recalled--despite the seriously dodgy gender politics, it was a reasonably well constructed story. I have, however, seen the Web numerous times, and there are no surprises. I am on Avon's side in this one.

When I did my rewatch-after-many-years (for the Unstoppable Cards synopses) of episodes I'd been avoiding, I was also pleasantly surprised by Power, which was better than I remembered.

You know, you really don't have to rewatch eps you dislike - there is nothing less sacred than an unenjoyable episode of a much-loved series. But having said that, it can be fun rewatching these episodes in company because you get the chance to slag off all the things you don't like and enter into (ahem) lively discussions with fellow fans. See the recent Moloch rewatch thread as an example!
http://www.blakes...ead_id=947
Twitter: @TravisinaB7
Tumblr: tumblr
There's no point being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes
 
littlesue
The Web has so many good moments…well I think so.
The dialogue is superb:
Blake: Avon, I need you on the Flight Deck.
Avon: I’m busy.
Blake: NOW, Avon.
The look on Avon’s face when Cally says, “I’m interested in your work.”
Blake’s reaction when the light on the bomb goes off and Avon hurls him across the deck, followed by this exchange.
Blake: Thank you…Why?
Avon: Automatic reaction. I’m as surprised as you are.
Blake: I’m not surprised.
Vila arriving on the Flight Deck, rubbing his head; All I asked was how do you like the outfit?!! (Grandson found that comment very funny!)
And later on, from Vila again,
Oh, that's marvellous. We're not sure where we are, but if they were sure they wouldn't know where it was anyway.
We see a side of Avon that we will see a side of later on with 54214...and Servie. He gets a tad angry with any female who crosses him, as per him grabbing Cally by the throat.
Avon being a bit rude to Gan about his IQ…and the ominous “There will come a time when he won’t be making the decisions.”
Etc.
The last attack by the Decimas is quite blood thirsty and I believe that they had complaints about it at the time.
And as for the creature in the tank….the budget for B7 was very small. They had to make do.
You also had to remember that they had no idea that in 40 years we would still be watching and discussing the show.
In comparison to what was being shown at the time, I think the production crew did all right.
So please watch The Web and even VFTP (The first part of which I enjoy immensely, with Avon’s concern for Blake becoming more obvious.)
You just have to switch part of your brain off…as a critic once remarked about the only way to watch Plan 9 From Outer Space!
But however you watch it, sit back and enjoy a classic late 70’s TV show from the Beeb…and be grateful they didn’t wipe it!!!
Cold.....you don't know the meaning of cold.
Cold is when you have ice on the INSIDE of the window!!!


sues stories http://sjlittle.w...
sues youtube channel http://www.youtub...e54/videos
sues book shelf https://www.media...ne%20Shelf
rebel run video http://www.youtub...prqS-XZtLo
Lara and Sue's Stories http://lectorisal....webs.com/
 
dragonq
The most boring episode is Volcano. The most unwatchable episode is Animals. There are some other pretty dreadful ones, like Ultraworld and Moloch, and others which are just sub-standard. I'd probably put The Web into that category.
 
meegat39
dragonq wrote:

The most boring episode is Volcano. The most unwatchable episode is Animals. There are some other pretty dreadful ones, like Ultraworld and Moloch, and others which are just sub-standard. I'd probably put The Web into that category.
r

Nah. The most boring episode is The Keeper with the first half of Bounty coming in second for me. Animals is just dreadful though with little to recommend it. Even with this there are a few glimmers of light: Vila overhauling the tanks in Scorpio...twice and Paul Darrow slipping as he enters the room. A bit of Shoot 'em up at the end too.
"If you didn't want the answer, you shouldn't have asked the question."
 
winnie-l
If I may pipe up with TT & Littlesue - find the parts you like & ENJOY THOSE because they're usually GREAT! As Sue pointed out there's lots good in The Web.
Look and you will find!

Go on - challenge you! - watch TheWeb & tell us some things you found to enjoy! Bet lots.
 
trevor travis
winnie-l wrote:

If I may pipe up with TT & Littlesue - find the parts you like & ENJOY THOSE because they're usually GREAT! As Sue pointed out there's lots good in The Web.
Look and you will find!

Go on - challenge you! - watch TheWeb & tell us some things you found to enjoy! Bet lots.


I like the conversation between Avon and Gan while they're discussing the auto-repair. Says much about the two characters.
 
meegat39
trevor travis wrote:

winnie-l wrote:

If I may pipe up with TT & Littlesue - find the parts you like & ENJOY THOSE because they're usually GREAT! As Sue pointed out there's lots good in The Web.
Look and you will find!

Go on - challenge you! - watch TheWeb & tell us some things you found to enjoy! Bet lots.


I like the conversation between Avon and Gan while they're discussing the auto-repair. Says much about the two characters.


Me too - forgot to mention that part!
"If you didn't want the answer, you shouldn't have asked the question."
 
winnie-l
Here are some other worthwhile things to watch for - or think on - re: 05.TheWeb, from various old mailing lists, forum posts, etc etc "out there".
(I'm not the author of ANY of these; if you think they're good, the only credit to me is finding, keeping, & reposting them)

Blake & Avon:

This episode is a critical one in showing the way that the relationship between Blake and Avon is developing. There's a lot of very subtle acting by both Paul and Gareth. The characters seem to have learnt to think on the other's wavelength to some extent.

AVON: What if something should happen to you and we can't get you back?
BLAKE: Then all you have to do is get everybody else out of this mess. (Stands within teleport area. Avon smiles slightly) All right, put me down.

What I enjoy in this particular exchange is the expression on Blake's face as he says it. In essence, he's sharing a joke with Avon. He's saying to Avon: "I know you're going to say that you'd grab the ship and leave me, so I'm giving you permission in advance. Then you'll be stuck having to solve this impossible mess..."

Also this scene is a rather neat echo/touch from 03.CygnusAlpha: Jenna's "What if something should happen to you and we can't get you back?" is echoed this time by Avon, and both Blake & Avon seem to know it: the shift in the relationship means this time Blake is able to tease Avon in response.

Avon saves Blake from the bomb Cally placed. Would Avon have done the same regardless of who it was? I think it is _because_ it was Blake. Note that Avon was quite prepared to let Raiker kill other prisoners on the London....

Was it an instinctive reaction on Avon's part?

Was it an instinctive desire to save life, or was it an instinctive action to save _Blake_?

BLAKE: Thank you. (Pause) Why?
AVON: Automatic reaction. I'm as surprised as you are.
BLAKE: I'm not surprised.

Blake's dialogue has more than one possible interpretation. On paper, it looks as though Blake isn't surprised that Avon saved his life. The usual fan interpretation is that Blake is aware of Avon's nobler side, knows that Avon cares for him, etc.

But when I hear the words onscreen, to me, Blake is saying that he's not surprised that Avon is surprised. There's a very slight edge of sarcasm. He's saying that he'd expect Avon to be surprised at finding he's just saved Blake's life, ie, Blake is aware of Avon's deeper nature, but he doesn't expect _Avon_ to be aware of it.

BLAKE: I don't give a damn about your power cells. There's a friend of mine out there. [ He turns and runs for the main entrance of the complex. Geela and Novara intercept him near the exit. ]

No ambiguity here - Blake's genuinely concerned (how often can you remember Blake swearing?) and he says "friend", not "one of my people".

Although the series gives us many occasions where we can judge Avon's feelings for Blake, we get very few where we can judge Blake's feelings on Avon - this is a clear example.
 
winnie-l
Avon & Cally

One view:
Cally is flirting (not very well) with Avon in the "Gee, Avon, which ones are the forward detectors?" scene.

Another view:
Avon, being rather more mush-headed than usual, was flattered by Cally's (supposed) interest in His Work and took a moment to gaze soulfully into her pretty alien face.
Hence his anger on the flight deck later when he realises what was _really_ going on ("Cally! It's Cally!")

Another view:
Cally was trying to telepathically project something to Avon, like "show me what you are doing" during that scene. He looks startled, and takes a second to respond. Possibly he was trying to understand where that odd feeling in his brain was coming from. It looks like telepsychomanipulation...

Someone mentioned they like how *startled* Avon seems when at Cally's ?flirting? with him. It's not an expression he shows very often, and it's very charming, almost innocent (if one can apply that word to Avon in any sense).

You can almost see the wheels turning in his head. Here's the general gist, with Avon's thoughts in ((...)):

> CALLY: (Touches her temple as if listening) Which are the forward detector links?
> AVON: What? (Pause)

((Damn. That's a good question. Which *are* the forward detector links...?!))

> AVON: Oh, ah (Pause)

((I'm pretty sure the aft detector links were to the right, so forward must be... Right, got it...))

> AVON: Those two there.

((I hope she didn't notice how long that took. Better divert her with a well placed question.))

> AVON: Why do you want to know that?

((Well done, Kerr my lad! She didn't notice a thing.))

> CALLY: I'm interested in your work.

((Huh?))

> AVON: (Pause) Yes.

((She's coming on to me. Better say something flippant. Um, let's see. "Come here often?" - don't be silly. "Like to see the aft detector links?" - nah, too obvious. "Wanna see the whole console blow up and repair itself?" - hmm, maybe that's a bit too nerdy. Perhaps I should say something nice about her hair... but that would be too mushy. Don't want to come across as a sop. And what if she *isn't* coming on to me? Maybe I'm just misreading it. That would be embarrassing, if I came up with some witty chat-up line and it really was my work she was interested in, *not* me. Oops, she's still looking at me!...
Better say *something*, *anything*...))

> AVON: (Pause) Well, I suppose I'd better go and see what it is that Blake wants. (Avon exits)

((Phew. That was a lucky escape. Let's see what Curly is getting so tetchy about....))
 
Spaceship Dispatcher
winnie-l wrote:

Avon & Cally

*snip*

Someone mentioned they like how *startled* Avon seems when at Cally's ?flirting? with him. It's not an expression he shows very often, and it's very charming, almost innocent (if one can apply that word to Avon in any sense).

You can almost see the wheels turning in his head. Here's the general gist, with Avon's thoughts in ((...)):

*snip*

Lol Grin

I like internal dialogues, and that one's especially amusing! Where did you find it, Winnie?
Reversing the polarity of the neutron flow. I bet that means something. It sounds great.

Blake's 7: Trojan Horse (s4 fanfic) - Blake's 7: Through the Needle's Eye (s2 fanfic)

Spaceship Dispatcher's fanfic site
 
littlesue
When I first watched B7 with Grandson, one of the things he said was 'There's a lot more things being unsaid in this programme'. And he would try and figure out just what the character was actually thinking.
Cold.....you don't know the meaning of cold.
Cold is when you have ice on the INSIDE of the window!!!


sues stories http://sjlittle.w...
sues youtube channel http://www.youtub...e54/videos
sues book shelf https://www.media...ne%20Shelf
rebel run video http://www.youtub...prqS-XZtLo
Lara and Sue's Stories http://lectorisal....webs.com/
 
Moon Disk
BradPaula wrote:
I'm thinking mainly of the guy in the fish tank- the 'Lost' of Auronare.


Why didn't he drown, that's what I've always wondered. Or manage to say afloat with no 'visible' (ahem!) means of support? Or why his body had withered but his head hadn't?

I'll watch it, but the squeaking really grates on my nerves these days. Praise be for the mute button and subtitles!
 
winnie-l
More of the same - good stuff about 05.TheWeb fr hither & yon.

The Decimas

The Decimas demonstrate the extent of Blake's definition of sentience and the extent of his sympathy for it. There's even a sort of Vitalist "Life Force" kind of tag line at the end: "You can't separate living creatures. Being alive involves them together."

The Decimas were begun as a 10 function organic tool - sort of a swiss army knife with legs. IOW, controllable slaves. But, like most organic creations, they promptly started showing their own will.

So what happened to them? Maybe once they'd finished destroying the base, they presumably settled into their own society free of the control or threat from the "Lost". In future generations they no doubt created their own mythology of throwing the serpent out of Eden with the assistance of "The Curly angel".....
 
winnie-l
Ditto ditto -

The Lost

Why a group that got kicked off Auron would be referred to as "The Lost" is unknown, unless they were talking about "Lost souls" or "marbles" perhaps??

They don't depend on finding a telepath on board any given passing ship, because they use Jenna at first in order to communicate. (Only later do they use Cally.)

Their normal modus operandi appears to be "catch passing ship in web, and offer to release it in exchange for relevant supplies".
Likely they've pulled this stunt before, whenever they needed something - maybe they're more desperate now, because local traffic has noticed ships keep disappearing in the vicinity, and has started to go the long way round.
So they have to use Cally to knock out the detectors so the Liberator's systems don't notice & warn about what's ahead.

So what about the webstuff? And did they do a 'minor trade in illegal genetic engineering projects'? (as in the nasty fungus possibly purposefully infecting Destiny in 07.MissionToDestiny??)

I see the Lost as the sort who went through science class saying, "Hey, if we do this, what do you think happens?" No number of small explosions, larger explosions, poisonous gases, or trips to the emergency room could change them.

The webstuff probably started with one of them saying, "I woke up this morning and thought, hey, what would happen if weeds _didn't_ need a planet to grow on? What if they could just grow in space?"

[ Answer: BIG TROUBLE! Ooops! ]

And one of their other projects started with someone saying, "Why _shouldn't_ cabbages be mobile?" Or perhaps they'd just heard about babies coming from the cabbage patch and thought, "Why not?"
 
Ela
For what it's worth, i watched The Web over the weekend. It certainly has moments that make it worth watching, many of which have already been mentioned.
 
dragonq
I still haven't managed to watch it. It's been a difficult week. I'd need a large block of chocolate and some very strong tea to approach those Decimas at the moment.

And I'd need to pick the chocolate carefully.
 
trevor travis
dragonq wrote:

I still haven't managed to watch it. It's been a difficult week. I'd need a large block of chocolate and some very strong tea to approach those Decimas at the moment.

And I'd need to pick the chocolate carefully.


Why not join in "The Web" rewatch a week tomorrow. Wink
 
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