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View Thread
 Volcano: do stupid plots really matter?
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| trevor travis |
Posted on 18 April 2015 20:30:44
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 Alpha Grade  Posts: 19829 Joined: 08 January 2014 |
Spaceship Dispatcher wrote: Considering that he allowed his daughter to get involved in a relationship with creepy Justin, Hal Mellanby's judgement of character is not exactly beyond question either. Hal Mellanby is quite an ambiguous figure. It does seem he may have betrayed some of his people to the Federation to get himself and Dayna out of trouble. Exactly what happened is left up to the imagination. |
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| Anniew |
Posted on 18 April 2015 21:17:26
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 Alpha Grade Posts: 2539 Joined: 13 January 2015 |
Considering that he allowed his daughter to get involved in a relationship with creepy Justin, Hal Mellanby's judgement of character is not exactly beyond question either. In fairness, he may not have known that he was perving on Dayna. She seems a pretty naughty girl to judge with how she greets Avon and he is blind! On the other hand, I agree Trevor, he does seem to have done a bit of betraying to keep him and Dayna safe. Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
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| Spaceship Dispatcher |
Posted on 18 April 2015 21:33:30
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 Alpha Grade Posts: 13529 Joined: 08 January 2014 |
Is it possible that Hower and Justin knew each other, introduced through Mellanby? That's one dinner party I'm trying not to imagine! Does the established continuity allow for them to have been associated at the same time? 
Reversing the polarity of the neutron flow. I bet that means something. It sounds great.
Blake's 7: Trojan Horse (s4 fanfic) - Blake's 7: Through the Needle's Eye (s2 fanfic) Spaceship Dispatcher's fanfic site |
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| Spaceship Dispatcher |
Posted on 18 April 2015 21:36:21
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Alpha Grade Posts: 13529 Joined: 08 January 2014 |
Which was my point rather; that he was a poor judge of character and didn't notice Justin’s dark side or Hower's. Not that he was party to anything inappropriate. Reversing the polarity of the neutron flow. I bet that means something. It sounds great.
Blake's 7: Trojan Horse (s4 fanfic) - Blake's 7: Through the Needle's Eye (s2 fanfic) Spaceship Dispatcher's fanfic site |
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| Anniew |
Posted on 19 April 2015 00:11:56
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Alpha Grade Posts: 2539 Joined: 13 January 2015 |
Ahh. Ok. Got it. It's certainly an interesting idea that they might have known each other on Earth. Though since Justin seems pro Federation, or at least works for them, wouldn't he have blown the whistle on Hal's underground hidey hole, given he'd visited it and knew its location?
Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
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| Spaceship Dispatcher |
Posted on 19 April 2015 12:33:43
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Alpha Grade Posts: 13529 Joined: 08 January 2014 |
I'm going to throw a bit of a different question into the ring: Just for the purpose of the exercise, please forget for a moment the wider context of the show and what we as viewers are privileged to know about the Federation and the rebellion; instead seeing Obsidian from the viewpoint of life upon the planet, which seems comparable to or perhaps even worse than life in the Dome as seen in the first episode. Bershar appears to stand against his father Hower's rule to one extent or another, though it's impossible to say how far his view of rulership is governed by his father's example, and so from his viewpoint is leading his own rebellion against tyranny. His trust in the Federation is misplaced, but his knowledge both of life beyond Obsidian and the rebellion is limited at best. To him, Blake's group are no more familiar than Avalon's group or Kasabi's group are to us. Bershar's rebellion against Hower is misguided, but then Blake's plans to ally himself with the Terra Nostra weren't much better ethically speaking. So, beyond his narrative role as being the foe of Tarrant and Dayna, and considering him subjectively as a character... Bershar: is he a protagonist and hero in the fight against tyranny, or an antagonist and ally of the Federation? Hero or villain? Reversing the polarity of the neutron flow. I bet that means something. It sounds great.
Blake's 7: Trojan Horse (s4 fanfic) - Blake's 7: Through the Needle's Eye (s2 fanfic) Spaceship Dispatcher's fanfic site |
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| Anniew |
Posted on 19 April 2015 13:54:04
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Alpha Grade Posts: 2539 Joined: 13 January 2015 |
I've always disliked Bershar because of his willingness to hand Dayna and Tarrant over to the Federation along with the rest of the crew and the Liberator. It's clear The Liberator crew represents no threat and he's part of a dying race anyway, so it seems fairly pointless. He seems childish and entirely motivated by the selfish desire to survive a little longer. He says he allies with Servalan because she is powerful and that the Liberator and her crew are insignificant because they are less powerful and are therefore expendable. If his Dad is a power mad dictator, it seems to me Bershar may be the next generation itching to step into Dad's shoes. Or he's just a boy who wants his Dad to love him, aggression and all and he's sick of creative macrame and weaving. Either way he's not particularly heroic imo, though I await with interest the counter arguments that will probably get me to change my mind! I think he might be a tragic figure though, who has grown up with agressive impulses without anyone or any cultural references to help him understand them. This would explain the rather child-like persona he has. A tragic anti hero perhaps? Ooh I might try writing about him!
Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
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| Anniew |
Posted on 19 April 2015 14:01:37
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Alpha Grade Posts: 2539 Joined: 13 January 2015 |
And I realise belatedly, my reply has ignored your request to ignore his narrative role. Objectively though, Servalan kills 2 Pyroans and Tarrant and Dayna don't, so the threat from Servalan is obvious and the defences on Obsidian have to have been set up against the threat of invasion which is more likely to have been from the Federation than say the andromendons. The Federation threatened to colonise the planet within his living memory and only withdrew because of the nuclear device, and are identified by Hower as his enemies. Rebellion against Dad seems the more likely motive rather than rebellion for an ideal of improving life, so tragic villain!
Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
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| Anniew |
Posted on 19 April 2015 14:14:01
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Alpha Grade Posts: 2539 Joined: 13 January 2015 |
Afterthought and then I'll shut up! There are parallels with Cally and Bershaw, both rebelling against the pacifist policies of their society. Cally fought for an ideal. Since she is a clone of Zelda who was willing to die for principles then presumably Cally is similarly self sacrificing. She defies her government by joining a rebel cell on another planet and is banished. Presumably Bershaw had same opportunities but chose to sacrifice others for personal power. ( including sacrificing his dad). So villain! And does this parallel make Hower less a dictator or Controller 1 on Auron more of one?
Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
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| Spaceship Dispatcher |
Posted on 21 April 2015 19:45:57
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Alpha Grade Posts: 13529 Joined: 08 January 2014 |
Even if he was a tyrant like his father, would lifting the threat of the bomb alone make him a (would be) hero of the Pyroan people? Progress often comes in stages rather than overnight, and revolutions are not always benevolent; yet, those concerned become heroes because of the advances that followed them.
Edited by Spaceship Dispatcher on 21 April 2015 19:53:33 Reversing the polarity of the neutron flow. I bet that means something. It sounds great.
Blake's 7: Trojan Horse (s4 fanfic) - Blake's 7: Through the Needle's Eye (s2 fanfic) Spaceship Dispatcher's fanfic site |
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| peladon |
Posted on 21 April 2015 20:42:40
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 Gamma Grade  Posts: 426 Joined: 16 January 2014 |
Anniew wrote: She defies her government by joining a rebel cell on another planet and is banished. ? Except that she didnt - she was sent by the Aurons to aid the rebels on Saurian Major. |
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| Anniew |
Posted on 21 April 2015 21:12:50
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Alpha Grade Posts: 2539 Joined: 13 January 2015 |
Pelladon : She says in Children of Auron she left and JOINED a group of freedom fighters on Sauron and was consequently exiled from Auron for her defiance of their neutrality policy which is why she has never returned there. I know this contradicts what she first told Blake but this is why I wrote she was banished!
Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
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| dragonq |
Posted on 23 April 2015 13:12:08
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 Gamma Grade Posts: 353 Joined: 20 April 2015 |
Volcano is probably the most boring episode of B7 ever. It has no redeeming features that I can think of. It's not even in the so-bad-it's-funny category.A plot has to be at least engaging enough to make the view want to sit through the episode. |
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| sweevo |
Posted on 23 April 2015 13:54:19
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 Beta Grade  Posts: 1462 Joined: 09 January 2014 |
There's at least one boring episode per season. My personal "bores" are: 1. The Web, Duel, Breakdown (Saved partially by guest star Julian Glover's performance) 2. Weapon, Horizon, Voice from the Past 3. Volcano, The Harvest of Kairos, Ultraworld 4. Power, Animals, Headhunter (The second half with Muller's android on the base drags a bit compared to the well-paced suspenseful first half) |
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| JustBrad |
Posted on 23 April 2015 15:30:49
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 Moderator  Posts: 6946 Joined: 12 January 2014 |
sweevo wrote: There's at least one boring episode per season. My personal "bores" are: ...Breakdown (Saved partially by guest star Julian Glover's performance)... Gan's 'feature' episode, in which he spends most of is unconscious. Poor David Jackson |
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| Rodney |
Posted on 23 April 2015 20:32:43
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 Delta Grade  Posts: 88 Joined: 04 January 2015 |
sweevo wrote: There's at least one boring episode per season. My personal "bores" are: 1. The Web, Duel, Breakdown (Saved partially by guest star Julian Glover's performance) 2. Weapon, Horizon, Voice from the Past 3. Volcano, The Harvest of Kairos, Ultraworld 4. Power, Animals, Headhunter (The second half with Muller's android on the base drags a bit compared to the well-paced suspenseful first half) I think Horizon is a Series 2 highlight, same for Ultraworld and Animals in the post-Blake era. I guess that's what makes the show fascinating as we all have our own opinions. As for Volcano, to me it's an OK episode, nothing more, nothing less. Vila: Where are all the good guys?
Blake: You could be looking at them. Avon: What a depressing thought! |
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| Tarrant On TV |
Posted on 01 June 2015 14:23:31
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 Delta Grade Posts: 69 Joined: 02 July 2014 |
dragonq wrote: Volcano is probably the most boring episode of B7 ever. It has no redeeming features that I can think of. It's not even in the so-bad-it's-funny category.A plot has to be at least engaging enough to make the view want to sit through the episode. Yeah, I find Volcano to be incredibly drab, not least because the Pyroans are such utterly drab characters, completely lacking in personality. Were my existence that drab, I'd not be too fussed by the thought of it ending either. |
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| Travisina |
Posted on 01 June 2015 14:51:04
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 Adminstrator  Wordsmith  Posts: 11974 Joined: 08 January 2014 |
Tarrant On TV wrote: Yeah, I find Volcano to be incredibly drab, not least because the Pyroans are such utterly drab characters, completely lacking in personality. Were my existence that drab, I'd not be too fussed by the thought of it ending either. LOL, ToTV - and welcome back, by the way! Volcano is probably my 3rd least-favourite episode (after Animals and Moloch), and I was quite vocal on the subject on the other thread here: http://www.blakes...ead_id=978 Twitter: @TravisinaB7
Tumblr: tumblr There's no point being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes |
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| Anniew |
Posted on 01 June 2015 20:35:59
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Alpha Grade Posts: 2539 Joined: 13 January 2015 |
Well I like Volcano so there! It's got a Volcano, Michael Gough, some humerous dialogue for Vila and Avon, an idea which might be rubbish but which has sparked lively debate and women in high heels faffing about on Mountains. Add in an unconvincing but rather sweet robot, a creepy Bershaw and Cally failing to be be telepathic and you have fifty five minutes of pleasant watching.
Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
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| Spaceship Dispatcher |
Posted on 01 June 2015 20:48:17
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Alpha Grade Posts: 13529 Joined: 08 January 2014 |
Anniew wrote: Well I like Volcano so there! It's got a Volcano, Michael Gough, some humerous dialogue for Vila and Avon, an idea which might be rubbish but which has sparked lively debate and women in high heels faffing about on Mountains. Add in an unconvincing but rather sweet robot, a creepy Bershaw and Cally failing to be be telepathic and you have fifty five minutes of pleasant watching. Hear, hear! I'll second that, as it was an episode that surprised me for actually being very good on recent rewatching despite the battering it gets from some corners of fandom. Referring back to the thread title, the basic premise is stupid because within the context of the fiction the ideas are supposed to be the stupid vanities of a madman. If the core concept (core concept! Geddit? Oh well, never mind...) was sensible then he wouldn't be a mad dictator! Reversing the polarity of the neutron flow. I bet that means something. It sounds great.
Blake's 7: Trojan Horse (s4 fanfic) - Blake's 7: Through the Needle's Eye (s2 fanfic) Spaceship Dispatcher's fanfic site |
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