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Current Poll

Who is your Favourite Guest Rebel?

Avalon - (Project Avalon)
Avalon - (Project Avalon)
18% [17 Votes]

Selma - (Horizon)
Selma - (Horizon)
5% [5 Votes]

Tyce - (Bounty)
Tyce - (Bounty)
15% [14 Votes]

Norm One - (Redemption)
Norm One - (Redemption)
2% [2 Votes]

Bek - (Shadow)
Bek - (Shadow)
6% [6 Votes]

Kasabi - (Pressure Point)
Kasabi - (Pressure Point)
19% [18 Votes]

Hal Mellanby - (Aftermath)
Hal Mellanby - (Aftermath)
15% [14 Votes]

Hunda - (Traitor)
Hunda - (Traitor)
5% [5 Votes]

Deva - (Blake)
Deva - (Blake)
9% [9 Votes]

Other
Other
6% [6 Votes]

Votes: 96
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Started: 09 July 2016

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Blake
JustBrad
sooper mouse wrote:

When did Blake do anything that went against his interests and the cause just so he can help someone, anyone?


Helping the Decimas in The Web
Mission to Destiny. There is nothing in it for Blake.
Breakdown. Did he really need Gan that badly?
Redemption. Helping the slaves even though he will be punished for it.
Trial. Willing to let his friends walk away if they think they will be safer. That does not help his cause in any way.
Killer. Placing the plague marker is against his interests in bringing down Servalan.
Hostage. Inga and Ushton may be family, but they are of no help to him.
Countdown. He found out what he needed from Provine, and stayed anyway.
 
President Solvite
e "let's force the tired crew to go because Blake is curious",


Incorrect he was following medical advice from Cally, apparently the most qualified medical person aboard.

re other issue

As Brad says above ^
 
http://nothingsforgotten.freeforums.net/
sooper mouse
JustBrad wrote:

[quote]sooper mouse wrote:

When did Blake do anything that went against his interests and the cause just so he can help someone, anyone?


Helping the Decimas in The Web I'll give you that
Mission to Destiny. There is nothing in it for Blake. Allies against the Federation?
Breakdown. Did he really need Gan that badly? I mentioned that- Blake is a lot more willing to do stuff for his obedient followers
Redemption. Helping the slaves even though he will be punished for it.
umm actually the slave helped him a lot more than he helped them. Also again, his life was at stake. He didn't help the slaves out of the kindness of his heart, the slave helped him first. Self interest
Trial. Willing to let his friends walk away if they think they will be safer. That does not help his cause in any way.
not really. Willing to bail out more like, and leave a highly manipulative message, that's not letting them walk away. At best it is a very skillful way to manipulate them and quash their unsatisfaction with his idiocy in PP.
If he was willing to let them go he would have abstained from the emotional blackmail


Killer. Placing the plague marker is against his interests in bringing down Servalan. Because he wants to be a hero. Yet he didn't care enough to inform Vila and Avon there was a plague spreading in the same station where they were. He literally shows more concern for Servalan than for his own crewmates.

Hostage. Inga and Ushton may be family, but they are of no help to him.
They are his family, Inga is his kissing cousin. He says it himself she used to be very important to him. Self interest at its best
Countdown. He found out what he needed from Provine, and stayed anyway.
Waiting to bail out when the count got to 50. Avon is the one who took his bracelet off and was wiling to go down with them
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
sooper mouse
President Solvite wrote:

e "let's force the tired crew to go because Blake is curious",


Incorrect he was following medical advice from Cally, apparently the most qualified medical person aboard.

re other issue

As Brad says above ^


Cally never said they should go to Horizon- she said they needed rest. Blake isn't going to Horizon to look for a rest place.
He wants to go because he is curious.

BLAKE Maintain present course.
JENNA [Disgruntled] If you insist.
CALLY You're not going to follow the freighter all the way to Horizon?
BLAKE Why not? I'm curious.
AVON Oh, you are curious. Well, I'm glad we have a worthwhile purpose.
BLAKE Doesn't it interest you a little?
AVON No. There's nothing out there. We are on the edge. Even Zen has nothing on it. That could mean anything. An experimental war zone, anything.
BLAKE That freighter's gone to Horizon for some good reason.
AVON Which is more than you can say for us.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
President Solvite
It serves multiple purposes, as Blake said what rest and rehabilitation centre would let them rest? Wherever they were was a risk, even staying put.

If they weren't being continually harried by Federation Patrols it would have been a perfect place to recharge.
 
http://nothingsforgotten.freeforums.net/
sooper mouse
President Solvite wrote:

It serves multiple purposes, as Blake said what rest and rehabilitation centre would let them rest? Wherever they were was a risk, even staying put.

If they weren't being continually harried by Federation Patrols it would have been a perfect place to recharge.


only it wasn't, and Blake never mentions that was his intention. He is curious so he endangers everyone by going through the magnetic barrier and onto a dangerous planet.
Where the only reason they didn't get killed was because Avon goes down to save them instead of taking the Liberator and putting 2 hours at standard by twelve between himself and the incoming flotilla.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
President Solvite
Staying put was dangerous, they are fugitives after all.

Going to Horizon did served multiple purposes the fact the Blake did not explicitly state it does not change that fact.
 
http://nothingsforgotten.freeforums.net/
sooper mouse
President Solvite wrote:

Staying put was dangerous, they are fugitives after all.

Going to Horizon did served multiple purposes the fact the Blake did not explicitly state it does not change that fact.


only because Avon saved them. Normal pattern- Blake puts them in danger, Avon saves them.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
StarOne
...and when Avon had no Blake he made a complete arse of the rebellion, losing the Liberator (and Scorpio) and then killing the biggest rallying call the resistance had.
This is stupid!
 
sooper mouse
StarOne wrote:

...and when Avon had no Blake he made a complete arse of the rebellion, losing the Liberator (and Scorpio) and then killing the biggest rallying call the resistance had.


something to do with him not being a rebel? Not even wanting to be one?
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
trevor travis
JustBrad wrote:

sooper mouse wrote:

When did Blake do anything that went against his interests and the cause just so he can help someone, anyone?


Helping the Decimas in The Web
Mission to Destiny. There is nothing in it for Blake.
Breakdown. Did he really need Gan that badly?
Redemption. Helping the slaves even though he will be punished for it.
Trial. Willing to let his friends walk away if they think they will be safer. That does not help his cause in any way.
Killer. Placing the plague marker is against his interests in bringing down Servalan.
Hostage. Inga and Ushton may be family, but they are of no help to him.
Countdown. He found out what he needed from Provine, and stayed anyway.


Brad, a few others:

Time Squad: bringing the projectile on-board.
Deliverance: getting the crew to search for survivors after the explosion.
Orac: taking the medical supplies to Ensor Snr.

As dreadfully as he goes about things, Blake seems quite often to be trying to do the right thing.
 
sooper mouse
trevor travis wrote:

JustBrad wrote:

sooper mouse wrote:

When did Blake do anything that went against his interests and the cause just so he can help someone, anyone?


Helping the Decimas in The Web
Mission to Destiny. There is nothing in it for Blake.
Breakdown. Did he really need Gan that badly?
Redemption. Helping the slaves even though he will be punished for it.
Trial. Willing to let his friends walk away if they think they will be safer. That does not help his cause in any way.
Killer. Placing the plague marker is against his interests in bringing down Servalan.
Hostage. Inga and Ushton may be family, but they are of no help to him.
Countdown. He found out what he needed from Provine, and stayed anyway.


Brad, a few others:

Time Squad: bringing the projectile on-board.
Deliverance: getting the crew to search for survivors after the explosion.
Orac: taking the medical supplies to Ensor Snr.

As dreadfully as he goes about things, Blake seems quite often to be trying to do the right thing.


i'm sure the 100 million label price of Orac or the fact they needed anti radiation pills had NOTHING to do with it. Not like he mentions it umpteen times.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
trevor travis
sooper mouse wrote:
i'm sure the 100 million label price of Orac or the fact they needed anti radiation pills had NOTHING to do with it. Not like he mentions it umpteen times.


Cheers Sooper Mouse - that's another one:

Orac: racing to Aristo for medical supplies not for himself, but for Vila, Gan, Avon and Jenna.
 
Anniew
I don't think Blake is completely self centred but I'll chuck in two thoughts here:

1. Blake's stated reason for opposing the Federation is that they butchered his family and friends and messed with his mind - nothing about the plight of the Deltas; the turning people into mutoids or crimmos; the enslaving of people who oppose the regime. Doesn't that strike you as a wee bit self-centered?

2. Giving his crew mates the choice of whether to save him or not during Trial is a piece of horrible manipulation. Not, " i'm so sorry I screwed up and caused the death of your companion.- can we talk face to face about this so I can hear what you are feeling and we can decide what we want to do." Instead he takes himself off and leaves the decision to them placing all the responsibility on them as if they're the ones at fault. I wouldn't have much respect for any friend of mine who was so absorbed with himself, his misery and guilt that he abrogated responsibility for his actions to me in this way.
Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
 
trevor travis
Anniew wrote:

I don't think Blake is completely self centred but I'll chuck in two thoughts here:

1. Blake's stated reason for opposing the Federation is that they butchered his family and friends and messed with his mind - nothing about the plight of the Deltas; the turning people into mutoids or crimmos; the enslaving of people who oppose the regime. Doesn't that strike you as a wee bit self-centered?

2. Giving his crew mates the choice of whether to save him or not during Trial is a piece of horrible manipulation. Not, " i'm so sorry I screwed up and caused the death of your companion.- can we talk face to face about this so I can hear what you are feeling and we can decide what we want to do." Instead he takes himself off and leaves the decision to them placing all the responsibility on them as if they're the ones at fault. I wouldn't have much respect for any friend of mine who was so absorbed with himself, his misery and guilt that he abrogated responsibility for his actions to me in this way.


Pressure Point / Trial are the episodes that show Blake at his very worst.

He's massively reckless in "Pressure Point" and then very manipulative in "Trial", although the whole "Poor Me" routine in Trial almost goes very wrong when he lands on the planet of spit Wink

Thank goodness that "Killer" comes next - a reminder that Blake has a good side as well.

As for being self-centred at times, of course he is! It is Mr Ego that we're talking about here Grin But there are times that he helps out others as well.
 
JustBrad
Anniew wrote:

I don't think Blake is completely self centred...


Indeed, in Blake's mind, it is not about Blake. It is about The Cause.
 
sooper mouse
trevor travis wrote:

Anniew wrote:

I don't think Blake is completely self centred but I'll chuck in two thoughts here:

1. Blake's stated reason for opposing the Federation is that they butchered his family and friends and messed with his mind - nothing about the plight of the Deltas; the turning people into mutoids or crimmos; the enslaving of people who oppose the regime. Doesn't that strike you as a wee bit self-centered?

2. Giving his crew mates the choice of whether to save him or not during Trial is a piece of horrible manipulation. Not, " i'm so sorry I screwed up and caused the death of your companion.- can we talk face to face about this so I can hear what you are feeling and we can decide what we want to do." Instead he takes himself off and leaves the decision to them placing all the responsibility on them as if they're the ones at fault. I wouldn't have much respect for any friend of mine who was so absorbed with himself, his misery and guilt that he abrogated responsibility for his actions to me in this way.


Pressure Point / Trial are the episodes that show Blake at his very worst.

He's massively reckless in "Pressure Point" and then very manipulative in "Trial", although the whole "Poor Me" routine in Trial almost goes very wrong when he lands on the planet of spit Wink

Thank goodness that "Killer" comes next - a reminder that Blake has a good side as well.

As for being self-centred at times, of course he is! It is Mr Ego that we're talking about here Grin But there are times that he helps out others as well.


Killer? You mean the episode in which Blake is enjoying being seen as generous and benevolent so much he can't possibly be bothered to think "hey, there's a deadly plague on this base and my two crewmates are somewhere around. I wonder if they're OK. Maybe I should warn them"
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
sooper mouse
trevor travis wrote:

Anniew wrote:

I don't think Blake is completely self centred but I'll chuck in two thoughts here:

1. Blake's stated reason for opposing the Federation is that they butchered his family and friends and messed with his mind - nothing about the plight of the Deltas; the turning people into mutoids or crimmos; the enslaving of people who oppose the regime. Doesn't that strike you as a wee bit self-centered?

2. Giving his crew mates the choice of whether to save him or not during Trial is a piece of horrible manipulation. Not, " i'm so sorry I screwed up and caused the death of your companion.- can we talk face to face about this so I can hear what you are feeling and we can decide what we want to do." Instead he takes himself off and leaves the decision to them placing all the responsibility on them as if they're the ones at fault. I wouldn't have much respect for any friend of mine who was so absorbed with himself, his misery and guilt that he abrogated responsibility for his actions to me in this way.


Pressure Point / Trial are the episodes that show Blake at his very worst.

He's massively reckless in "Pressure Point" and then very manipulative in "Trial", although the whole "Poor Me" routine in Trial almost goes very wrong when he lands on the planet of spit Wink

Thank goodness that "Killer" comes next - a reminder that Blake has a good side as well.

As for being self-centred at times, of course he is! It is Mr Ego that we're talking about here Grin But there are times that he helps out others as well.


I'd say his worst is Star One.
That final manipulation of Avon ( we all know he didn't trust him from the very beginning) was pretty cruel and unnecessary. Arguably, that's what broke Avon.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
trevor travis
sooper mouse wrote:
I'd say his worst is Star One.
That final manipulation of Avon ( we all know he didn't trust him from the very beginning) was pretty cruel and unnecessary. Arguably, that's what broke Avon.


I do interpret that look in Star One as "Don't try to manipulate me, Blake... especially not now!!" Grin

But Avon's a big boy and able to look after himself. I don't think it 'breaks' him. If Avon does break (and I'm not sure he ever does, he just becomes stressed out), then it's the events of Gold, Orbit, Warlord and Blake which do it.

IMO I don't see the Avon of e.g. Death-Watch as at all broken.
 
sooper mouse
trevor travis wrote:

sooper mouse wrote:
i'm sure the 100 million label price of Orac or the fact they needed anti radiation pills had NOTHING to do with it. Not like he mentions it umpteen times.


Cheers Sooper Mouse - that's another one:

Orac: racing to Aristo for medical supplies not for himself, but for Vila, Gan, Avon and Jenna.


without whom he couldn't run the ship. It only counts as altruistic behaviour when you don't stand to gain from it.
Edited by sooper mouse on 30 December 2016 22:17:50
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
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