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Current Poll

Who is your Favourite Guest Rebel?

Avalon - (Project Avalon)
Avalon - (Project Avalon)
18% [17 Votes]

Selma - (Horizon)
Selma - (Horizon)
5% [5 Votes]

Tyce - (Bounty)
Tyce - (Bounty)
15% [14 Votes]

Norm One - (Redemption)
Norm One - (Redemption)
2% [2 Votes]

Bek - (Shadow)
Bek - (Shadow)
6% [6 Votes]

Kasabi - (Pressure Point)
Kasabi - (Pressure Point)
19% [18 Votes]

Hal Mellanby - (Aftermath)
Hal Mellanby - (Aftermath)
14% [13 Votes]

Hunda - (Traitor)
Hunda - (Traitor)
5% [5 Votes]

Deva - (Blake)
Deva - (Blake)
9% [9 Votes]

Other
Other
6% [6 Votes]

Votes: 95
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Started: 09 July 2016

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Cally
trevor travis
President Solvite wrote:

Terry of course didn't write (fully in some cases) the later episodes. So some responsibility on this must lie with CB being the script editor.

In a way this is why I prefer the earlier B7 seasons as I find this is where B7 was ahead of its time. Having strong female characters who could (at times) go toe to toe with their male contemporaries.


Oh, the responsibility would lie with CB. And also the credit for Soolin, the second strongest female character in B7 (behind the Supreme Commander, of course). Soolin can definitely can toe-to-toe with male contemporaries - she saves Avon's bacon twice (Assassin and Warlord), and even threatens him in Blake.
 
trevor travis
So then, apparently Terry Nation couldn't write for women.

And yet:
1. Terry Nation's Survivors was ahead of its time in its treatment of its female characters (how many other series in 1975, had two out of three lead characters as female? ).
2. Terry Nation's Blake's 7 was ahead of its time in its treatment of its female characters.

And that's before we mention the likes of Sara Kingdom from Doctor Who.

I think it's safe to say that Terry certainly COULD write for women.
 
President Solvite
Indeed the Soolin of season 4 is reminiscent of our initial view of Cally in Time Squad..

A seasoned soldier where her companions were brutally killed. Very similar to Soolin a gunfighter (with good combat experience) where her family were abused and killed. It's almost as if someone had struck out Cally on the script and replaced with Soolin Smile

Instead Cally veers into almost a pacifist, and there's nothing wrong with that , but its a direction completely at odds with our introduction to her character and what we can glean from her background and the Federation's foreign policy
 
http://nothingsforgotten.freeforums.net/
sooper mouse
trevor travis wrote:

So then, apparently Terry Nation couldn't write for women.

And yet:
1. Terry Nation's Survivors was ahead of its time in its treatment of its female characters (how many other series in 1975, had two out of three lead characters as female? ).
2. Terry Nation's Blake's 7 was ahead of its time in its treatment of its female characters.

And that's before we mention the likes of Sara Kingdom from Doctor Who.

I think it's safe to say that Terry certainly COULD write for women.


I really didn't like Survivors. Sorry
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
trevor travis
sooper mouse wrote:
I really didn't like Survivors. Sorry


That's Ok. You're entitled to your opinion.

I was simply pointing out how female-led that Survivors was.
 
sooper mouse
trevor travis wrote:

sooper mouse wrote:
I really didn't like Survivors. Sorry


That's Ok. You're entitled to your opinion.

I was simply pointing out how female-led that Survivors was.


yes, but there's a big difference between having x number of female characters and them being GOOD female characters.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
trevor travis
sooper mouse wrote:

trevor travis wrote:

sooper mouse wrote:
I really didn't like Survivors. Sorry


That's Ok. You're entitled to your opinion.

I was simply pointing out how female-led that Survivors was.


yes, but there's a big difference between having x number of female characters and them being GOOD female characters.


IMO Abby Grant, in particular, is a superb character. Survivors was never the same after its first season, after both Terry Nation and Carolyn Seymour (Abby) departed.
 
President Solvite
Indeed the first Survivors season was the best.

Its the same with the novels.

First Survivors book excellent, second read like a piece of bad fan fiction.
 
http://nothingsforgotten.freeforums.net/
trevor travis
President Solvite wrote:

Indeed the first Survivors season was the best.

Its the same with the novels.

First Survivors book excellent, second read like a piece of bad fan fiction.


Never read the second one Wink

The first one is superb and gives a big clue of how Survivors would have developed had Terry not lost control of the show to producer Terence Dudley.
 
sooper mouse
President Solvite wrote:

Indeed the Soolin of season 4 is reminiscent of our initial view of Cally in Time Squad..

A seasoned soldier where her companions were brutally killed. Very similar to Soolin a gunfighter (with good combat experience) where her family were abused and killed. It's almost as if someone had struck out Cally on the script and replaced with Soolin Smile

Instead Cally veers into almost a pacifist, and there's nothing wrong with that , but its a direction completely at odds with our introduction to her character and what we can glean from her background and the Federation's foreign policy


Cally should have remained the initial character, she doesn't really fit as a pacifist and that's why the character feels a bit wrong. But obviously Nation didn't want two strong female characters. Cally had to be the shy girl next door to Jenna's alpha so she is turned into this high morality pacifist that doesn't entirely gel.

A pity
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
JustBrad
sooper mouse wrote:


Cally should have remained the initial character, she doesn't really fit as a pacifist and that's why the character feels a bit wrong. But obviously Nation didn't want two strong female characters. Cally had to be the shy girl next door to Jenna's alpha so she is turned into this high morality pacifist that doesn't entirely gel.

A pity


A pity indeed. Cally and Jenna both changed drastically after the first half dozen episodes, falling from guerrilla fighter and capable smuggler to teleport minders. It was the '70's after all, when male characters ruled every aspect of television.
 
sooper mouse
JustBrad wrote:

sooper mouse wrote:


Cally should have remained the initial character, she doesn't really fit as a pacifist and that's why the character feels a bit wrong. But obviously Nation didn't want two strong female characters. Cally had to be the shy girl next door to Jenna's alpha so she is turned into this high morality pacifist that doesn't entirely gel.

A pity


A pity indeed. Cally and Jenna both changed drastically after the first half dozen episodes, falling from guerrilla fighter and capable smuggler to teleport minders. It was the '70's after all, when male characters ruled every aspect of television.


But Blake did take Cally on a lot of missions, and Jenna was supposed to mind the ship, after all she was the pilot.
I think there was probably an intention somewhere to have Jenna as a love interest for Blake and Cally for Avon but it kinda didn't work out like that since Blake and Avon are a bit too absorbed in their friendship/bitter feud.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
JustBrad
sooper mouse wrote:



But Blake did take Cally on a lot of missions, and Jenna was supposed to mind the ship, after all she was the pilot.


Jenna the pilot, yes, and yet just a few episodes in, Blake is telling her, the smuggler, how to maneuverer against the Federation ships.
And Cally the fighter becomes Cally the nurse, who lets Gan loose in Breakdown.
 
sooper mouse
JustBrad wrote:

sooper mouse wrote:



But Blake did take Cally on a lot of missions, and Jenna was supposed to mind the ship, after all she was the pilot.


Jenna the pilot, yes, and yet just a few episodes in, Blake is telling her, the smuggler, how to maneuverer against the Federation ships.
And Cally the fighter becomes Cally the nurse, who lets Gan loose in Breakdown.


Breakdown is why I can't stand Cally as a character, she is insufferably illogical. Especially as a telepath/empath there is no excuse for her to let Gan loose, plus a whole series of others.
Probably the only character whose death I was ok with. Bad, bad writing.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
Dtar
sooper mouse wrote:

President Solvite wrote:

Indeed the Soolin of season 4 is reminiscent of our initial view of Cally in Time Squad..

A seasoned soldier where her companions were brutally killed. Very similar to Soolin a gunfighter (with good combat experience) where her family were abused and killed. It's almost as if someone had struck out Cally on the script and replaced with Soolin Smile

Instead Cally veers into almost a pacifist, and there's nothing wrong with that , but its a direction completely at odds with our introduction to her character and what we can glean from her background and the Federation's foreign policy


Cally should have remained the initial character, she doesn't really fit as a pacifist and that's why the character feels a bit wrong. But obviously Nation didn't want two strong female characters. Cally had to be the shy girl next door to Jenna's alpha so she is turned into this high morality pacifist that doesn't entirely gel.

A pity


I agree that Cally's character should have remained as she was introduced. She went from guerilla fighter in leather to almost like Spock's mother...still strong and with a strong moral compass, but swishing around the ship in long, flowing gowns and seeming much more peaceful.
Suddenly upon thinking of it, I think it might have been interesting to keep her a stong character, constantly butting heads with Jenna similar to Avon and Blake.
 
sooper mouse
Dtar wrote:

sooper mouse wrote:

President Solvite wrote:

Indeed the Soolin of season 4 is reminiscent of our initial view of Cally in Time Squad..

A seasoned soldier where her companions were brutally killed. Very similar to Soolin a gunfighter (with good combat experience) where her family were abused and killed. It's almost as if someone had struck out Cally on the script and replaced with Soolin Smile

Instead Cally veers into almost a pacifist, and there's nothing wrong with that , but its a direction completely at odds with our introduction to her character and what we can glean from her background and the Federation's foreign policy


Cally should have remained the initial character, she doesn't really fit as a pacifist and that's why the character feels a bit wrong. But obviously Nation didn't want two strong female characters. Cally had to be the shy girl next door to Jenna's alpha so she is turned into this high morality pacifist that doesn't entirely gel.

A pity


I agree that Cally's character should have remained as she was introduced. She went from guerilla fighter in leather to almost like Spock's mother...still strong and with a strong moral compass, but swishing around the ship in long, flowing gowns and seeming much more peaceful.
Suddenly upon thinking of it, I think it might have been interesting to keep her a stong character, constantly butting heads with Jenna similar to Avon and Blake.


I have some issues with that "strong moral compass" as on third fourth and fifteenth watch there are some details that on analysis are quite unpleasant- she is a fanatic and enabler of Blake at his worst in S2.
She is also far too careless of others' well being over her refusal to understand she is no longer on Auron.( people get put in restraints for a reason)
Point of view and all that- probably the lack of a good character direction has a lot to do with it.
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
Anniew
I think the dynamic with Avon was interesting ( not in a shipping sense but because they approach problems from different perspectives and it added tension to stories) and her leaving did make the crew interactions less complex.

I'm not sure her willingness to blow up communication centres and space cities was ever thought through. As a telepath,surely she'd have felt all those deaths and been affected by them??
Just because I can't sing doesn't mean I won't.
 
sooper mouse
Anniew wrote:

I think the dynamic with Avon was interesting ( not in a shipping sense but because they approach problems from different perspectives and it added tension to stories) and her leaving did make the crew interactions less complex.

I'm not sure her willingness to blow up communication centres and space cities was ever thought through. As a telepath,surely she'd have felt all those deaths and been affected by them??


yeah, Boucher should've been more careful with the consistency of the scripts. Cally as a character makes very little sense.
Edited by sooper mouse on 30 December 2016 20:19:09
I have concluded that Jenna is Blake-aware, Blake is Avon-aware, Avon is self-aware and Gan is rarely aware. Vila is merely wary. Cally is frequently more away than aware.
 
thewayback7
Cally. My Name is Cally
by Michelle Birkby
The thoughts of the first three people from the Liberator to meet Cally.


Sounds about right, except that by the next episode Avon wants her "locked up or dumped".
 
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